[katzore]

Well, I personally don't think it's true..Mostly because it doesn't seem to make much sense and because i have not found any information really leading to this... But i'm hearing some people claiming that you can in fact get kicked off your health insurance plan if they find out you are using mmj. Is this true?

[EarthMama]

I wouldn't doubt it...It's just not completely socially accepted, yet...

[zaa]

does drinking alcohol bar you from insurance? possibly if you have a pre-existing condition BECAUSE of the booze.

do they revoke your insurance if you need to go to the hospital because of a cocaine OD?

seems shady if anyone actually DID get theirs revoked, sounds like they let themselves get bullied while the insurance co was looking for a cheap way out.

[DankJews]

Yeah That Doesn't Sound As If It Would But You Never Know These Days Ignorant People Sit Behind Those Desks! They Know A B But Forget About The "C"(c for cannabis hahah)

.:Stay Medicated:.

[Juba]

Originally Posted by katzore

Well, I personally don't think it's true..Mostly because it doesn't seem to make much sense and because i have not found any information really leading to this... But i'm hearing some people claiming that you can in fact get kicked off your health insurance plan if they find out you are using mmj. Is this true?

Anything you fail to disclose about your health status can be cause for "rescission" of your health benefits. When individuals have large claims because of a health crisis their insurance company turns over their files to investigators who look for any reason to deny coverage, including any inconsistencies in statements patients have made to doctors or in the information people put on the various forms they are asked to fill out over the years.

On the other hand, disclosing that you use medical marijuana can be used as the basis for refusing to accept you in a health plan or for dropping you. Insurance companies can refuse to insure people for any reason.

This situation puts all MM patients between a rock and a hard place.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by Juba

Anything you fail to disclose about your health status can be cause for "rescission" of your health benefits. When individuals have large claims because of a health crisis their insurance company turns over their files to investigators who look for any reason to deny coverage, including any inconsistencies in statements patients have made to doctors or in the information people put on the various forms they are asked to fill out over the years.

On the other hand, disclosing that you use medical marijuana can be used as the basis for refusing to accept you in a health plan or for dropping you. Insurance companies can refuse to insure people for any reason.

This situation puts all MM patients between a rock and a hard place.

Just say NO! Never ever disclose you use MMJ to any doctor other than your MMJ doctor. That way they will not be able to find out you use MMJ. That is the reality. If you disclose your MMJ use to a doctor and they write it down it becomes part of your record that insurance companies WILL use against you.

[Markit8]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

Just say NO! Never ever disclose you use MMJ to any doctor other than your MMJ doctor. That way they will not be able to find out you use MMJ. That is the reality. If you disclose your MMJ use to a doctor and they write it down it becomes part of your record that insurance companies WILL use against you.

I agree that MMJ patients need to be very careful who they tell about their MMJ use: discretion is key.

I can imagine a situation with a bad doctor, lame insurance, and bad luck in which a patient might be denied coverage because of MMJ... it's our responsibility to concieve of the worst case senarios as to hopefully avoid them.

I strongly disagree however, that this worst case senario should mean that MMJ patients should not disclose their use to their doctor. These decisions should be made on a per-doctor basis with best possible discretion being used, but if possible, your primary physician should definitely know.

If you have a good doctor, this is likely what will happen:

You will tell him/her once, they will respond with whatever input they have as far as their opinions (or they might even hesitate to respond/tell you to keep that quiet), and they wont write anything about it down... but they will know and be able to advise you accordingly later on down the road.

Few doctors are eager to lose patients over something like this, and it's surprising how many are actually receptive to open dialog.

I doubt that many doctors will be eager to have long drawn out conversations about usage, efficacy, etc, but at least they will know and will be able to warn you about potential interactions or other problems that might arise.

There are a vast number of medications that are either counteracted by MMJ use or intensified. Having a doctor who really knows whats going on in your physiological life can be the difference between being sick and healthy.

I would argue that the majority of MMJ users are more likely to be denied coverage because of whatever pre-existing condition they are treating themselves for than their MMJ alone.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by Markit8

I agree that MMJ patients need to be very careful who they tell about their MMJ use: discretion is key.

I can imagine a situation with a bad doctor, lame insurance, and bad luck in which a patient might be denied coverage because of MMJ... it's our responsibility to concieve of the worst case senarios as to hopefully avoid them.

I strongly disagree however, that this worst case senario should mean that MMJ patients should not disclose their use to their doctor. These decisions should be made on a per-doctor basis with best possible discretion being used, but if possible, your primary physician should definitely know.

If you have a good doctor, this is likely what will happen:

You will tell him/her once, they will respond with whatever input they have as far as their opinions (or they might even hesitate to respond/tell you to keep that quiet), and they wont write anything about it down... but they will know and be able to advise you accordingly later on down the road.

Few doctors are eager to lose patients over something like this, and it's surprising how many are actually receptive to open dialog.

I doubt that many doctors will be eager to have long drawn out conversations about usage, efficacy, etc, but at least they will know and will be able to warn you about potential interactions or other problems that might arise.

There are a vast number of medications that are either counteracted by MMJ use or intensified. Having a doctor who really knows whats going on in your physiological life can be the difference between being sick and healthy.

I would argue that the majority of MMJ users are more likely to be denied coverage because of whatever pre-existing condition they are treating themselves for than their MMJ alone.

If you tell your doctor and he/she writes it down you are forever fucked if you attempt to obtain individual health insurance. I'm not saying thats right, it just is reality. BTW what drugs are you talking about and how do you expect a medical doctor to know possible contra-indications?

[New Leaf Family]

If you go to a licenced md. for your rec, you are covered by HIPPA laws, and no one should be able to get hold of your info without a subpoena. In CA, as long as you have your rec, and make sure the co-ops you are visiting are set up legally ( Non-Profit, Mutual Benefit Corps ) you should be fine.

[sb420fan]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

Just say NO! Never ever disclose you use MMJ to any doctor other than your MMJ doctor. That way they will not be able to find out you use MMJ. That is the reality. If you disclose your MMJ use to a doctor and they write it down it becomes part of your record that insurance companies WILL use against you.

++

[Markit8]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

If you tell your doctor and he/she writes it down you are forever fucked if you attempt to obtain individual health insurance. I'm not saying thats right, it just is reality. BTW what drugs are you talking about and how do you expect a medical doctor to know possible contra-indications?

I'm really not looking to confront you with this, but I have to ask you: Why are you "fucked" if you're Doc writes it down? Where are you getting your information from? Have you experienced this personally? If not, you should be willing to concede that there is a middle ground here and that personal discretion as per the doctor in question is whats key to this situation.

Not everyone is out to screw you and there are some very strict privacy laws in CA that protect you from 1 - having your MMJ info spread (with the usual exceptions you should've been made aware of when you got your rec) and 2 - from insurance companies discriminating against you as a result.

You are choosing to use some very strong words and represents your claims as though you know 100% that anyone who discloses MMJ info to their doc is making a big mistake (one of many nicer ways to say "fucked"). I know from personal experience that you cannot be 100% correct, because I have disclosed my MMJ status to every doctor I have and have had since becoming a patient.

As for your question about meds and my doc knowing about interactions... are you really so stuck on this point that you cant imagine that a doctor might at least have some knowledge of how a prescription drug might interact with MMJ? I'm sure most medical professionals could at least make educated guesses that are more accurate than those of the average MMJ user. Both my general doc, my neurologist, and my psychiatrist have all been able to offer priceless insight into how my MMJ use might interact with other meds I have taken.

Not every average MMJ user can research the pharmacokinetics and pharmacodymanics of MMJ as well as every prescription drug they are on to then be able to cross-correlate and find potential problems. Most doctors have enough of a general knowledge to be able to provide loads of insight here where patients cant for themselves. If you have a good doctor, they might even go out of their way to do some extra research to ensure your health and well-being. Not all docs are pot-unfriendly, and not all are pot-ignorant.

How dare you ask me what meds I'm talking about... you've got high rep points and have been around here for a long time: you know I'm not gonna tell everyone here what meds I'm on. This is what we call a fallacy of rhetoric... trying to make a point by poisoning the well; using a "scarecrow."

I think that you are doing a great disservice to this community by continuing to present this issue as if it were black and white. People here need to know that, with proper discretion, it is a smart move to let your doctor know what else you are putting into your body other than what they are prescribing. It could mean the difference between healthy and sick. It could also save lives. Many anti-anxiety, anti-depressant, and pain medications effects are intensified by MMJ use. It'd be a real shame for someone to figure that out by getting into a car accident when all they had to do was have a conversation with their doc about it.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by Markit8

I'm really not looking to confront you with this, but I have to ask you: Why are you "fucked" if you're Doc writes it down? Where are you getting your information from? Have you experienced this personally? If not, you should be willing to concede that there is a middle ground here and that personal discretion as per the doctor in question is whats key to this situation.

Not everyone is out to screw you and there are some very strict privacy laws in CA that protect you from 1 - having your MMJ info spread (with the usual exceptions you should've been made aware of when you got your rec) and 2 - from insurance companies discriminating against you as a result.

You are choosing to use some very strong words and represents your claims as though you know 100% that anyone who discloses MMJ info to their doc is making a big mistake (one of many nicer ways to say "fucked"). I know from personal experience that you cannot be 100% correct, because I have disclosed my MMJ status to every doctor I have and have had since becoming a patient.

As for your question about meds and my doc knowing about interactions... are you really so stuck on this point that you cant imagine that a doctor might at least have some knowledge of how a prescription drug might interact with MMJ? I'm sure most medical professionals could at least make educated guesses that are more accurate than those of the average MMJ user. Both my general doc, my neurologist, and my psychiatrist have all been able to offer priceless insight into how my MMJ use might interact with other meds I have taken.

Not every average MMJ user can research the pharmacokinetics and pharmacodymanics of MMJ as well as every prescription drug they are on to then be able to cross-correlate and find potential problems. Most doctors have enough of a general knowledge to be able to provide loads of insight here where patients cant for themselves. If you have a good doctor, they might even go out of their way to do some extra research to ensure your health and well-being. Not all docs are pot-unfriendly, and not all are pot-ignorant.

How dare you ask me what meds I'm talking about... you've got high rep points and have been around here for a long time: you know I'm not gonna tell everyone here what meds I'm on. This is what we call a fallacy of rhetoric... trying to make a point by poisoning the well; using a "scarecrow."

I think that you are doing a great disservice to this community by continuing to present this issue as if it were black and white. People here need to know that, with proper discretion, it is a smart move to let your doctor know what else you are putting into your body other than what they are prescribing. It could mean the difference between healthy and sick. It could also save lives. Many anti-anxiety, anti-depressant, and pain medications effects are intensified by MMJ use. It'd be a real shame for someone to figure that out by getting into a car accident when all they had to do was have a conversation with their doc about it.

You are freaky. Read what I said. If your doctor writes down you use MMJ and you apply for individual medical insurance, the insurance company is entitled to those records, and will likely turn you down. If you have group insurance they are not legally allowed to turn you down in California. How that got to me causing a freaking traffic accident you will have to explain. You said MMJ interferes with or accentuates certain drugs, so I asked which ones. How you twisted this into some sort of battle royale is kind of scary. If you think I am incorrect about something, just post, but in this case I will say that I know alot about the subject. Wow, what are they putting in the water these days...

[contract.dude]

Originally Posted by katzore

Well, I personally don't think it's true..Mostly because it doesn't seem to make much sense and because i have not found any information really leading to this... But i'm hearing some people claiming that you can in fact get kicked off your health insurance plan if they find out you are using mmj. Is this true?

yes, the use of marijuana or other drugs can make you in-illegible for your health benefit from an insurance company and can cause you to have other insurance's you might have paid for canceled.. life, automotive etc.

read your policy.. each is different.

if you lie regarding your use, your policy can be termed also. That possibly could effect everyone on your policy not just you.(Family)((or even remove your right to life insurance money you payed for))

its best to read your policy.

[Markit8]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

You are freaky. Read what I said. If your doctor writes down you use MMJ and you apply for individual medical insurance, the insurance company is entitled to those records, and will likely turn you down. If you have group insurance they are not legally allowed to turn you down in California. How that got to me causing a freaking traffic accident you will have to explain. You said MMJ interferes with or accentuates certain drugs, so I asked which ones. How you twisted this into some sort of battle royale is kind of scary. If you think I am incorrect about something, just post, but in this case I will say that I know alot about the subject. Wow, what are they putting in the water these days...

It wasn't my intent to seem combative, but you were using some very strong language and you made some strong claims that might lead others to avoid talking to their physicians about MMJ. These forums are here to inform, not to scare. If you had presented some sort of documentation or a personal experience to back-up your claim, then you would be helping to inform the community. As you haven't, it seems as though you are exaggerating an opinion as if it were fact: this I would argue, hurts the community.

There is no "Battle Royale" here, and please, this isn't personal, you don't need to refer to me as "freaky." I simply and strongly disagree with the claims you have made about private insurance turning you down because of MMJ on your doctors notes. This simply isn't true. I'm sure that there is some possible situation in which a carrier might, but I've searched and searched and have yet to find a documented case of this ever happening.

I have also talked to both MMJ and non-MMJ doctors and neither seemed to think that such a comment on a doctors notes would cause any problems with private insurance. As I said before, they'd be much more concerned with your pre-existing conditions than your medical use of MJ.

I think you are choosing to take my comments out of context: I think you need to read what I wrote again. How I could possibly claim that you might be causing traffic accidents is absurd. I was trying to illustrate how important such a conversation with a doctor might be. I was also trying to illustrate the importance of looking at this from a different perspective.There is a deep-rooted fear/resentment of the medical community amongst the MMJ community that is a relic of the past and needs updating.

[Markit8]

Originally Posted by contract.dude

yes, the use of marijuana or other drugs can make you in-illegible for your health benefit from an insurance company and can cause you to have other insurance's you might have paid for canceled.. life, automotive etc.

read your policy.. each is different.

if you lie regarding your use, your policy can be termed also. That possibly could effect everyone on your policy not just you.(Family)((or even remove your right to life insurance money you payed for))

its best to read your policy.

Thanks for the input. It really does depend on the policy.

All of that is presupposed by your doctors discretion as to what he/she writes down. But this helps to assess the risk you take in disclosing such info.

[referee4]

California Healthcare Provider, The HealthCare Solution, Finds Backdoor to Insure Marijuana-Users
December 18, 2007 11:00 AM Eastern Time
WOODLAND HILLS, Calif.--(EON:Enhanced Online News)--The HealthCare Solution (THCS), a California-based health insurance brokerage, has launched an effective program that gets marijuana-users instant approval for California health insurance.

“It is my duty to make sure every eligible individual can purchase affordable California health insurance at their will.”
Due to strict underwriting guidelines set by California’s major health insurance institutions, marijuana-users run-the-risk of losing their health, jobs and relationships by being denied health insurance. However, a Los Angeles Healthcare provider, California Health Insurance - plan information, has found a legal backdoor to get these ineligible applicants the healthcare they need.

On December 11th, 2007, The Healthcare Solution released a new program called California Health PLUS, aimed at supplying medical insurance to marijuana-users. Now, for the first time since 1937, recreational marijuana-users can experience their daily activities with full health coverage.

California Health PLUS, is a partnership with leading health and fitness expert Lesley Stein CPT (member of the National Council of Certified Trainers). It includes a 3-step educational and fitness awareness program designed to increase the approval rate for marijuana-users seeking California Health Insurance.

The California Health PLUS 3-step programs include:

1. A List of 16 Smart-Health Tips by Lesley Stein, CPT
2. Fitness Consulting
3. Strategic Health Plan Selection.

“It is my duty to make sure every eligible individual can purchase affordable California health insurance at their will.” –Fred Wiener, President of THCS

For years it’s been rumored that applicants falsify applications to get insured. As a result, applicants get denied, plans get retroactively canceled and in rare instances, litigation occurs. This has lead to a growing number of Americans without health insurance.

Since The HealthCare Solution has launched California Health PLUS, more applicants are submitting accurate applications and are getting the health insurance with the coverage they need.

If you are considering California Health Insurance for yourself, family or company and would like to apply, visit California Health Insurance - plan information or contact The Healthcare Solution.

About The HealthCare Solution:

Founded in 2002 by Fredrick Wiener in Woodland Hills, The HealthCare Solution is recognized as one of the top agencies of Blue Cross of California Health Insurance. The HealthCare Solution offers a variety of different carriers and insurance types including POS, PPO and HMO. The core philosophy behind the success of The HealthCare Solution is “Bringing you a peace of mind.”

Location: 21031 Ventura Blvd. STE 603 Woodland Hills, CA 91364 Phone: 888-959-2273 Website: California Health Insurance - plan information

About Lesley Stein CPT:

Located in Northridge, CA, Leading Fitness consultant to seniors and member of the “National Council of Certified Personal Trainers,” Lesley Stein has been coaching since 1993. A past sales rep for Body Wise Medical Supplements and Aqua Aerobics Instructor, she has been helping her clients achieve mental and physical well-being. Her core philosophy is that “everyone is different and achieving good health is nothing short of a voyage we must all take!”

Location: 18531 Roscoe Blvd. STE #207A Northridge, CA 91324 Phone: 818-470-6115


Contacts
Connection Marketing
Michael H. Stein, 818-385-0699
Connection Marketing
Permalink: California Healthcare Provider, The HealthCare Solution, Finds Backdoor to Insure Marijuana-Users

[LocalBud]

I have read many stories to that effect.

[CarlSagan]

Let's get real.

We are talking about health insurance companies. They only make money by denying people access to medicine. They are in the business of denying people.

Surviving a rape is a pre-existing condition.
Being a victim of domestic violence is a pre-existing condition.

They will look for any reason to deny anyone access to health care.

I am not an expert in health insurance and I do not know if anyone has ever actually lost health insurance because of mmj.

But I would not be surprised if a health insurance company denied coverage because of mmj, and I've heard of one man who was denied a liver transplant because of mmj...

I won't tell any doctor other than my mmj doctor unless is was absolutely necessary.

At least until we have better health insurances options than whats available today.

[OldTroll]

Originally Posted by katzore

Well, I personally don't think it's true..Mostly because it doesn't seem to make much sense and because i have not found any information really leading to this... But i'm hearing some people claiming that you can in fact get kicked off your health insurance plan if they find out you are using mmj. Is this true?

Damn, this isn't rocket science! Pick up the phone and call your insurance company.

Say to them, "I am an MMJ user. Does this affect my insurance coverage?" This is the only way that you will know the answer with any certainty.

Waiting until you need their help, only to find out that MMJ voids your coverage, would really suck. Crossing your fingers won't help. Yelling that it's your right to smoke dope won't help. Stoners on this forum won't help. Phone your insurance company.

-OT

YMMV
-OT

[fish2find]

Calling insurance, great idea.

I also tend to agree with the whole "Keep your mouth shut". Ive seen Docs turn on clients instantly labeling them "drug addicts" and immediately discounting any legible complaint , sometimes traumatic events completely looked over due to coming into the ER with a pipe.

[CarlSagan]

Originally Posted by OldTroll

Damn, this isn't rocket science! Pick up the phone and call your insurance company.

Say to them, "I am an MMJ user. Does this affect my insurance coverage?" This is the only way that you will know the answer with any certainty.

Waiting until you need their help, only to find out that MMJ voids your coverage, would really suck. Crossing your fingers won't help. Yelling that it's your right to smoke dope won't help. Stoners on this forum won't help. Phone your insurance company.

-OT

YMMV
-OT

I have two responses.

First. Please do not call your insurance provider and tell them you use mmj. This information will only be used against you. If you really want to call and ask, say that you are asking about a hypothetical situation. This way, your call cannot be used against you.

Second. Even if the insurance company responds to your "hypothetical" scenario by saying that they will not deny coverage to a mmj patient, keep in mind that your health insurance company can change your policy at any time. Like a credit card, its all in the fine print.

The good news is that if you keep your mmj status to yourself (this is not good for mmj as a social movement, but sometimes its important to lookout for yourself) there are only a few ways that your insurance provider can learn about your mmj status.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by OldTroll

Damn, this isn't rocket science! Pick up the phone and call your insurance company.

Say to them, "I am an MMJ user. Does this affect my insurance coverage?" This is the only way that you will know the answer with any certainty.

Waiting until you need their help, only to find out that MMJ voids your coverage, would really suck. Crossing your fingers won't help. Yelling that it's your right to smoke dope won't help. Stoners on this forum won't help. Phone your insurance company.

-OT

YMMV
-OT

Terrible advice I would say! I call insurance companies all the time, and I usually get a different answer each time. The folks manning the phones are at the very bottom of the totem pole, so if you listen to them you are in trouble! Call an insurance salesperson, they know exactly what passes muster and what the immoral insurance cartel will accept.

[Smilodon]

I think calling an insurance salesperson is the best way to go as well. You may risk exaggeration to get you to buy, but I doubt they would outright lie about the coverage to get the sale. Not because they are that honest, but because it is easy to check when you sign.

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by Markit8

I'm really not looking to confront you with this, but I have to ask you: Why are you "fucked" if you're Doc writes it down? Where are you getting your information from? Have you experienced this personally? If not, you should be willing to concede that there is a middle ground here and that personal discretion as per the doctor in question is whats key to this situation.

Not everyone is out to screw you and there are some very strict privacy laws in CA that protect you from 1 - having your MMJ info spread (with the usual exceptions you should've been made aware of when you got your rec) and 2 - from insurance companies discriminating against you as a result.

You are choosing to use some very strong words and represents your claims as though you know 100% that anyone who discloses MMJ info to their doc is making a big mistake (one of many nicer ways to say "fucked"). I know from personal experience that you cannot be 100% correct, because I have disclosed my MMJ status to every doctor I have and have had since becoming a patient.

As for your question about meds and my doc knowing about interactions... are you really so stuck on this point that you cant imagine that a doctor might at least have some knowledge of how a prescription drug might interact with MMJ? I'm sure most medical professionals could at least make educated guesses that are more accurate than those of the average MMJ user. Both my general doc, my neurologist, and my psychiatrist have all been able to offer priceless insight into how my MMJ use might interact with other meds I have taken.

Not every average MMJ user can research the pharmacokinetics and pharmacodymanics of MMJ as well as every prescription drug they are on to then be able to cross-correlate and find potential problems. Most doctors have enough of a general knowledge to be able to provide loads of insight here where patients cant for themselves. If you have a good doctor, they might even go out of their way to do some extra research to ensure your health and well-being. Not all docs are pot-unfriendly, and not all are pot-ignorant.

How dare you ask me what meds I'm talking about... you've got high rep points and have been around here for a long time: you know I'm not gonna tell everyone here what meds I'm on. This is what we call a fallacy of rhetoric... trying to make a point by poisoning the well; using a "scarecrow."

I think that you are doing a great disservice to this community by continuing to present this issue as if it were black and white. People here need to know that, with proper discretion, it is a smart move to let your doctor know what else you are putting into your body other than what they are prescribing. It could mean the difference between healthy and sick. It could also save lives. Many anti-anxiety, anti-depressant, and pain medications effects are intensified by MMJ use. It'd be a real shame for someone to figure that out by getting into a car accident when all they had to do was have a conversation with their doc about it.

I know from personal experience that disclosing that information can come back to haunt you should you ever be involved in civil litigation. Part of a personal injury law suit entails waiving your right to privacy in terms of access to your medical records.

Learn from my mistake and listen to BB- JUST SAY NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by OldTroll

Damn, this isn't rocket science! Pick up the phone and call your insurance company.

Say to them, "I am an MMJ user. Does this affect my insurance coverage?" This is the only way that you will know the answer with any certainty.

Waiting until you need their help, only to find out that MMJ voids your coverage, would really suck. Crossing your fingers won't help. Yelling that it's your right to smoke dope won't help. Stoners on this forum won't help. Phone your insurance company.

-OT

YMMV
-OT

I don't know what insurance company you have, but as a former Kaiser patient, I can say that this is horrible advice. Kaiser won't discuss anything like this with you until you've verified your identity. Once they know exactly who you are, telling them you're an MMJ user is straight up stupid, unless you're looking for trouble.