[VooDoo Chile]

Obama sent another 13,000 troops into the Quagmire o' quagmires.

Support Troops Swelling U.S. Force in Afghanistan
Additional Deployments Not Announced and Rarely Noted

President Obama announced in March that he would be sending 21,000 additional troops to Afghanistan. But in an unannounced move, the White House has also authorized -- and the Pentagon is deploying -- at least 13,000 troops beyond that number, according to defense officials.

The additional troops are primarily support forces, including engineers, medical personnel, intelligence experts and military police. Their deployment has received little mention by officials at the Pentagon and the White House, who have spoken more publicly about the combat troops who have been sent to Afghanistan.

The deployment of the support troops to Afghanistan brings the total increase approved by Obama to 34,000. The buildup has raised the number of U.S. troops deployed to the war zones of Iraq and Afghanistan above the peak during the Iraq "surge" that President George W. Bush ordered, officials said.

The deployment does not change the maximum number of service members expected to soon be in Afghanistan: 68,000, more than double the number there when Bush left office. Still, it suggests that a significant number of support troops, in addition to combat forces, would be needed to meet commanders' demands. It also underscores the growing strain on U.S. ground troops, raising practical questions about how the Army and Marine Corps would meet a request from Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal, the top U.S. and NATO commander in Afghanistan.

Defense experts said the military usually requires that thousands of support troops deploy for each combat brigade of about 4,000. That, in turn, exacerbates the strain on the force, in part because support troops are some of the most heavily demanded in the military and are still needed in large numbers in Iraq.


"There are admittedly some challenges over the next 10 to 12 months as we are downsizing in Iraq, and therefore any schedule for increasing in Afghanistan might have to be more gradual," said Michael E. O'Hanlon, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution.

Pentagon and White House officials have not publicized significant deployments of support troops. For example, when Bush announced the Iraq surge, he spoke only of 20,000 combat troops and did not mention the approximately 8,000 support troops that would accompany them. When Gen. David H. Petraeus announced that the surge would end, he spoke only of the withdrawal of the combat units because he needed to retain many of the support troops in Iraq.

On Afghanistan, White House and Pentagon spokesmen differed over exactly what the president has approved.

Obama announced in a March 27 speech that he was approving 21,000 troops, and a White House spokesman said that the president did not approve any other increases before or after. Asked for more details on the troop authorizations, spokesman Tommy Vietor said the Pentagon was better suited to provide such "technical information."

Defense officials, however, acknowledge that the request for 21,000 troops has led to the authorization of more forces.

"The 21,000 are only combat forces, and when the combat forces go in, there are a certain amount of additional forces that are required," said Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman. Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates, who signs the deployment orders, had military officials identify last spring the entire scope of the increase and agreed that he would consult with Obama again if the Pentagon sought to go above that, Whitman said.

"Obama authorized the whole thing. The only thing you saw announced in a press release was the 21,000," said another defense official familiar with the troop-approval process.


It's a two page article, but ya get idea.

[patient's premium collective]

Thank u great & informative thread as always.

[contract.dude]

The general is asking for another giant amount on top of these men and women. (40000 to 60000 according to different websites)

poor leadership....

something on tonight

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/obamaswar/

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by contract.dude

The general is asking for another giant amount on top of these men and women. (40000 to 60000 according to different websites)

poor leadership....

something on tonight

FRONTLINE: Coming Soon: Obama's War | PBS

Holy Crap Nuggets, that's a butt load o' troops! WTF.

[BrattonBasher]

I did not expect Obama to start wrapping this mess up. We will be stuck there for years. People have connected some Saudi Nationals hijacking planes to peasent farmers in Afghanistan. The Afghan people are sick of us, the topography is impossible, and insurgents will continue to wreak havoc.

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

I did not expect Obama to start wrapping this mess up. We will be stuck there for years. People have connected some Saudi Nationals hijacking planes to peasent farmers in Afghanistan. The Afghan people are sick of us, the topography is impossible, and insurgents will continue to wreak havoc.

Eh, I didn't expect it either. He did after all campaign on this very issue.

But a girl can HOPE can't she????? Actually, in light of recent events, I guess not.

How long do ya think we'll be in there? Another 5 years, 10, 15? Sigh.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by VooDoo Chile

Eh, I didn't expect it either. He did after all campaign on this very issue.

But a girl can HOPE can't she????? Actually, in light of recent events, I guess not.

How long do ya think we'll be in there? Another 5 years, 10, 15? Sigh.

Depends on Iran. We very well might have to leave Afghanistan if the war hawks succeed and draw us into Iran.

[Oxfarm]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

Depends on Iran. We very well might have to leave Afghanistan if the war hawks succeed and draw us into Iran.

War with Iran isn't going to happen. Not American troops anyway. Israel vs. Iran seems likely though. Almost seems like Russia is blocking sanctions simply to hasten the Israeli preemptive attack. If that happens, the price of oil skyrockets again; which benefits Russia's huge oil industry.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by Oxfarm

War with Iran isn't going to happen. Not American troops anyway. Israel vs. Iran seems likely though. Almost seems like Russia is blocking sanctions simply to hasten the Israeli preemptive attack. If that happens, the price of oil skyrockets again; which benefits Russia's huge oil industry.

Israel goes in, so do we. Syria and Lebanon/Hezbollah will invade Israel in a second if it gets bogged down by Iran. In fact Hezbollah is directly funded and armed by Iran, so they will be in the fray. Israel could not beat Hezbollah in the recent war because their tactics involve hiding behind civillians. Israel is not capable of waging a war with Iran IMHO, things are different these days.

[Oxfarm]

I don't agree that we will follow Israel into Iran. IMHO, first thing that happens, Israel takes out the nuke facilities with bunker busters. Then... more talks... no all out war, Iran can't fight a war without their surrogates Hezbollah, Hamas.

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by Oxfarm

I don't agree that we will follow Israel into Iran. IMHO, first thing that happens, Israel takes out the nuke facilities with bunker busters. Then... more talks... no all out war, Iran can't fight a war without their surrogates Hezbollah, Hamas.

Do you think Hamas and Hezbollah would not join the fray? And Iran is exponentially more powerful and better equipped than any enemy Israel has ever fought with. Iran has a navy and many missles. Hezbollah and likely Hamas would rain rockets on Israel if they invade or bomb Iran. Plus you galvenize the population of Iran that hates the government the second the first bomb drops. IMHO You need to study what has happened recently with Israel and temper that notion I used to have that they are the neighborhood tough guys. The days of the Egyptian Army abandoning tanks and running for cover are long gone. These are fierce fighters who don't really give a shit about living or dying since they will have hundreds of virgins waiting for them, and they love to hide with the civilians.

[shecky7]

...and the leg bone connected to the hip bone. The hip bone connected to the...

[referee4]

Can anyone here suggest a better way to go about the Afghanistan situation,

After all you send that many troops to a war zone and lose so many , you cannot just pull out and say oh dear we would not win so ,, hey it was worth a try,

Vietnam anyone ?

[contract.dude]

lets make Afghanistan another state in our great nation and tax them to death.....

we can use their dirt to fill the grand canyon.

we can use their dope and sell it to china and Russia

we can use their labor to build more GM cars without having to pay them nice union people...

um, idk, anyone else got something?

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by referee4

Can anyone here suggest a better way to go about the Afghanistan situation,

After all you send that many troops to a war zone and lose so many , you cannot just pull out and say oh dear we would not win so ,, hey it was worth a try,

Vietnam anyone ?

Thats what I would suggest we do. The topography does not allow for "nation building". The longer we stay, the more young people we lose and the more money we waste.

[referee4]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

Thats what I would suggest we do. The topography does not allow for "nation building". The longer we stay, the more young people we lose and the more money we waste.

So your suggesting just pull out and leave the mess to the locals to deal with .. good idea.

BUT what do you tell the American people back home.

OOPS sorry your son/daughter/wife/husband died because we fkd up again ? . nah problem we can always fk up again so your relative will not be the last.

[danx_qz0]

.....

thanx for the new run down it hurts to find out the US is still going to be sending our boys out ....

i hope they ALL return safely and healthy

ill have a blunt, jay, bong bowl, pipe bowl, vapo bowl, hash bowl, etc ready for them when they come back

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by referee4

So your suggesting just pull out and leave the mess to the locals to deal with .. good idea.

BUT what do you tell the American people back home.

OOPS sorry your son/daughter/wife/husband died because we fkd up again ? . nah problem we can always fk up again so your relative will not be the last.

I play poker. You have to know when to fold em. It was flawed logic that got us into two wastefull overseas wars. Sure, some bad shit might happen in Afghanistan if we pull out, but lets save our money and resources and let the actual residents dictate what happens. The connection between a bunch of Saudis who hijacked some planes and Afghanistan was only tenuous at best. Neocons are foolishly calling for us or Israel to attack Iran. I long for peace. The more we inject ourselves into the radical Muslim world, the more we suffer IMHO.

[contract.dude]

colonize the place i tell you!!

http://pubs.usgs.gov/fs/2009/3070/pdf/FS09-3070.pdf




There are a lot of resources that will keep us there for a long time. If we are not there, someone else will be.

If we put taco bells and McDonalds on every street corner maybe we can win their people over to our good life.. ahh the good life..

we need to make them fat, lazy and brain dead ..

[BrattonBasher]

Originally Posted by contract.dude

colonize the place i tell you!!

http://pubs.usgs.gov/fs/2009/3070/pdf/FS09-3070.pdf




There are a lot of resources that will keep us there for a long time. If we are not there, someone else will be.

If we put taco bells and McDonalds on every street corner maybe we can win their people over to our good life.. ahh the good life..

we need to make them fat, lazy and brain dead ..

What might be funny to you or I is exactly what they are rightly accusing us of, colonizing them.

[DankJews]

Oh Obama.......! What Is There To Say About This Man?

Not All Too Much

.:Stay Medicated:.

[contract.dude]

Originally Posted by BrattonBasher

What might be funny to you or I is exactly what they are rightly accusing us of, colonizing them.

Not just them but probably every country in the Mideast thinks that's what we are doing.

What was the downfall of the roman empire?

I have done my research for the day project already...

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by referee4

So your suggesting just pull out and leave the mess to the locals to deal with .. good idea.

BUT what do you tell the American people back home.

OOPS sorry your son/daughter/wife/husband died because we fkd up again ? . nah problem we can always fk up again so your relative will not be the last.

I'm with BB.

And it wouldn't be the first, nor the last time, the U.S. government's fucked up. Nothing new there.

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by contract.dude

colonize the place i tell you!!

http://pubs.usgs.gov/fs/2009/3070/pdf/FS09-3070.pdf




There are a lot of resources that will keep us there for a long time. If we are not there, someone else will be.

If we put taco bells and McDonalds on every street corner maybe we can win their people over to our good life.. ahh the good life..

we need to make them fat, lazy and brain dead ..

I was under the impression that this is what the military's calling "Plan A."

[contract.dude]

Originally Posted by VooDoo Chile

I was under the impression that this is what the military's calling "Plan A."

the taco bell part?

the military people are not trained to babysit or police nations.. they are a fighting force. go in take over is what we excel in, the rest of the stay in has been the "oh no" part..

im not an expert at military things though.. so i could be wrong.

i admire the commitment the people in the armed forces give. They do a great job.

Can you imagine a home invasion, they go in and take control. completely. then after they do, they start fixing the door they kicked in, painting the walls where the blood is, asking if the people want to order a pizza and be friends after the event..