[DreamSmoker]

A California Court of Appeals decision for the first time gives cities and counties the choice to allow or disallow medical marijuana dispensaries.

In a Tuesday decision, the California Court of Appeal published an opinion upholding a lower court's injunction stopping a medical marijuana dispensary from operating in Los Angeles County.

In this case, the city of Claremont issued a moratorium preventing the issuance of a business license or other approvals for medical marijuana dispensaries as uses not permitted under the city's zoning ordinance.

Earlier this week in Lake Forest messengers began delivering 35 civil complaints against property owners and tenants connected to 14 medical marijuana dispensaries in the city. The city hopes to shut down the shops. The city's municipal code prohibits uses not explicitly allowed in commercial areas and prohibits businesses that violate state and federal law, said City Attorney Scott Smith.

"The decision is important to Lake Forest because the decision says not only that cities can decide whether or not to allow dispensaries but that state law – Compassionate Use Act – does not require cities to allow marijuana dispensaries," said Jeffrey Dunn, an attorney with Best, Best and Krieger who is handling the cases for Lake Forest.

Pot dispensary advocates argued almost two weeks ago at the Lake Forest City Council that that cities did not have the right to regulate or ban dispensaries because the Compassionate Use Act allows persons to use marijuana for certain medicinal uses.

But Dunn said that the Compassionate Use Act has the purpose to exempt certain people with specific medical conditions from violating state criminal law. He added that federal law still forbids marijuana use.

In light of the recent court ruling Dunn said the case could be precedent-setting and could and for the first time provide clarity and guidance to California counties and cities facing decisions regarding the regulation of marijuana dispensaries.

"From a legal perspective, it's a big deal," he said. "Now a city and county can decide to have or not have a dispensary. It clarified what a city can do."

About 150 pro-pot proponents vowed to return for the October City Council meeting to work toward keeping city dispensaries going by collaborating with city officials on how to regulate them.

"The solution is to regulate them," said Ryan Michaels, 27, who works with several of the Lake Forest dispensaries, to assure they are in compliance. "I don't think the problem is the city of Lake Forest. They are being pushed by their attorneys. The solution is regulating them and mitigating them through patient fundraisers. Potentially, we can come to a compromise."

Dunn said that there are cities in the state that have allowed dispensaries and attempted to regulate them.

"It's a struggle," he said. "How do you keep illegal activities out of them? That's really tough to do."
http://www.420magazine.com/forums/in...ce-cities.html

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

A California Court of Appeals decision for the first time gives cities and counties the choice to allow or disallow medical marijuana dispensaries.

In a Tuesday decision, the California Court of Appeal published an opinion upholding a lower court's injunction stopping a medical marijuana dispensary from operating in Los Angeles County.

In this case, the city of Claremont issued a moratorium preventing the issuance of a business license or other approvals for medical marijuana dispensaries as uses not permitted under the city's zoning ordinance.

Earlier this week in Lake Forest messengers began delivering 35 civil complaints against property owners and tenants connected to 14 medical marijuana dispensaries in the city. The city hopes to shut down the shops. The city's municipal code prohibits uses not explicitly allowed in commercial areas and prohibits businesses that violate state and federal law, said City Attorney Scott Smith.

"The decision is important to Lake Forest because the decision says not only that cities can decide whether or not to allow dispensaries but that state law – Compassionate Use Act – does not require cities to allow marijuana dispensaries," said Jeffrey Dunn, an attorney with Best, Best and Krieger who is handling the cases for Lake Forest.

Pot dispensary advocates argued almost two weeks ago at the Lake Forest City Council that that cities did not have the right to regulate or ban dispensaries because the Compassionate Use Act allows persons to use marijuana for certain medicinal uses.

But Dunn said that the Compassionate Use Act has the purpose to exempt certain people with specific medical conditions from violating state criminal law. He added that federal law still forbids marijuana use.

In light of the recent court ruling Dunn said the case could be precedent-setting and could and for the first time provide clarity and guidance to California counties and cities facing decisions regarding the regulation of marijuana dispensaries.

"From a legal perspective, it's a big deal," he said. "Now a city and county can decide to have or not have a dispensary. It clarified what a city can do."

About 150 pro-pot proponents vowed to return for the October City Council meeting to work toward keeping city dispensaries going by collaborating with city officials on how to regulate them.

"The solution is to regulate them," said Ryan Michaels, 27, who works with several of the Lake Forest dispensaries, to assure they are in compliance. "I don't think the problem is the city of Lake Forest. They are being pushed by their attorneys. The solution is regulating them and mitigating them through patient fundraisers. Potentially, we can come to a compromise."

Dunn said that there are cities in the state that have allowed dispensaries and attempted to regulate them.

"It's a struggle," he said. "How do you keep illegal activities out of them? That's really tough to do."
http://www.420magazine.com/forums/in...ce-cities.html

I can't say I'm surprized. Y'all do realize that alcohol operates in a similar manner, right? That's why ya see "dry counties" in other states like Utah and Texas. The 21st Amendment does not bar cities/counties from banning alcohol sales, so why would we expect MMJ to be any different?

And please don't respond with a diatribe on how MMJ is a medicine and alcohol isn't, as if I'm living on another planet and somehow don't know that my medical rec is designed to give me access to my medicine. That's not the point. I'm drawing a legal parallel. That's what judges do.

[DreamSmoker]

Originally Posted by VooDoo Chile

I can't say I'm surprized. Y'all do realize that alcohol operates in a similar manner, right? That's why ya see "dry counties" in other states like Utah and Texas. The 21st Amendment does not bar cities/counties from banning alcohol sales, so why would we expect MMJ to be any different?

And please don't respond with a diatribe on how MMJ is a medicine and alcohol isn't, as if I'm living on another planet and somehow don't know that my medical rec is designed to give me access to my medicine. That's not the point. I'm drawing a legal parallel. That's what judges do.

I would agree with you if all of us Patients are out to score and get High...
Are you one of those who believes this???
Dispensaries are not like Liquor Stores....
The are Privately run and only dispense to qualified Patients... They are not Opened to the General Public.. Huge Difference....

[cephas]

Exactly what VDC said.

This is not surprising and really now even a big deal, personally I think cities should be able to choose what kind of businesses they want. The downside is this gives all the elected cowards a way out....don't want to deal with it, then just don't....and the citizens forced to drive for hours to get meds safely?

Who cares, potheads don't vote anyway.

That seems to be the attitude.

Sad.

Besides, it doesn't really matter what the cities ban or do not. If and when MJ gets fully legalized, WalMart will rip their bans and lawyers to shreads in less than a month, and every single Walmart, drug store, liquor store, 7/11 and other corner market will have all the cheap nasty weed your heart could desire......all of it genetically engineered to be addictive.....yay....progress...


Gotta love being ruled by cowardly idiots, who protect themselves from us, while they and us are both slowly being destroyed by the WalMarts, against whom there is no protection......I'm starting to believe in open revolt being America's only hope for recovery from our current situation...problem is how do you openly revolt against a government who would rather throw you in jail then listen? Revolt without violence that is. I don't believe in hurting people, but then neither do I believe in standing by and letting myself and others get hurt, kind of a catch 22....unfortunately if one of those beliefs has to go, it won't be the one where I don't let myself get hurt....I don't think these idiots realize how many feel like this....and how close some are to acting instead of talking.....and getting closer with every single layoff, lowered wage, and raised gas/milk/food price......

[X Runner]

Unfortunately, we aren't guaranteed convenient access. Just safe access. But driving for hours to get meds seems like such a waste of resources and time.

[EarthMama]

I thought it was already the law, that it's up to the cities...Didn't consider the counties...So, I'm really not surprised at all. Let's just do all we can to keep it legal where we live, if we can. We are voices for change! A voice for the MMJ movement...Keep up the good works, everybody...

[DreamSmoker]

Originally Posted by cephas

Exactly what VDC said.

This is not surprising and really now even a big deal, personally I think cities should be able to choose what kind of businesses they want. The downside is this gives all the elected cowards a way out....don't want to deal with it, then just don't....and the citizens forced to drive for hours to get meds safely?

Who cares, potheads don't vote anyway.

That seems to be the attitude.

Sad.

Besides, it doesn't really matter what the cities ban or do not. If and when MJ gets fully legalized, WalMart will rip their bans and lawyers to shreads in less than a month, and every single Walmart, drug store, liquor store, 7/11 and other corner market will have all the cheap nasty weed your heart could desire......all of it genetically engineered to be addictive.....yay....progress...


Gotta love being ruled by cowardly idiots, who protect themselves from us, while they and us are both slowly being destroyed by the WalMarts, against whom there is no protection......I'm starting to believe in open revolt being America's only hope for recovery from our current situation...problem is how do you openly revolt against a government who would rather throw you in jail then listen? Revolt without violence that is. I don't believe in hurting people, but then neither do I believe in standing by and letting myself and others get hurt, kind of a catch 22....unfortunately if one of those beliefs has to go, it won't be the one where I don't let myself get hurt....I don't think these idiots realize how many feel like this....and how close some are to acting instead of talking.....and getting closer with every single layoff, lowered wage, and raised gas/milk/food price......

There is a word for what is going on: tyranny

[X Runner]

Originally Posted by cephas

Exactly what VDC said.

This is not surprising and really now even a big deal, personally I think cities should be able to choose what kind of businesses they want. The downside is this gives all the elected cowards a way out....don't want to deal with it, then just don't....and the citizens forced to drive for hours to get meds safely?

Who cares, potheads don't vote anyway.

That seems to be the attitude.

Sad.

Besides, it doesn't really matter what the cities ban or do not. If and when MJ gets fully legalized, WalMart will rip their bans and lawyers to shreads in less than a month, and every single Walmart, drug store, liquor store, 7/11 and other corner market will have all the cheap nasty weed your heart could desire......all of it genetically engineered to be addictive.....yay....progress...


Gotta love being ruled by cowardly idiots, who protect themselves from us, while they and us are both slowly being destroyed by the WalMarts, against whom there is no protection......I'm starting to believe in open revolt being America's only hope for recovery from our current situation...problem is how do you openly revolt against a government who would rather throw you in jail then listen? Revolt without violence that is. I don't believe in hurting people, but then neither do I believe in standing by and letting myself and others get hurt, kind of a catch 22....unfortunately if one of those beliefs has to go, it won't be the one where I don't let myself get hurt....I don't think these idiots realize how many feel like this....and how close some are to acting instead of talking.....and getting closer with every single layoff, lowered wage, and raised gas/milk/food price......

It is sad about the perception of cannabis users as non-voters. And the perception might even be true. However, it will take far more than voting at this point to keep most dispensaries in business with the coming ordinance. The face of medical marijuana is changing radically in Los Angeles yet only 50 advocates found the time to attend the Sept. 22 PLUM meeting. Many more dispensary operators and their loyal patients need to voice their opinion to these people if only with your presence. Another thread in WeedTRACKER is titled "I Want My Democracy Now". If you want democracy, earn it.

[cephas]

You are entirely correct.

Part of the problem, I think, is the perception of having to choose which battles to fight.

I know due to what I am doing in IB, as well as other political maneuverings I am trying to do, I have been counseled not to attend meetings in LA, as supporting one might hurt the other.

Honestly I don't know how this could be, but I have been following the advise simply because it comes from people who know more than me.

At the same time I see how it leaves us fractured and powerless in a lot of ways. It leaves us with a very non-unified front.

Personally I think I may have to stop following that advise, as we need more unity. At the same time it is hard to risk all the work I have done to support someone else...even if the risk is only percieved and may or may not be real....

...and honestly, I think as a group MMJ users are no less likely to vote than say plumbers....lets face it, everybody is so disgusted with our system almost nobody votes anymore....that is part of how these cowards remain in power, those who would vote them out, don't vote cause they don't like the competition any better, and those who do vote are, primarily, tools of whatever party they belong to....as long as you stay in good with your party, you get re-elected....simple, don't challenge the status Quo, keep your job...just like everywhere else.

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

I would agree with you if all of us Patients are out to score and get High...
Are you one of those who believes this???
Dispensaries are not like Liquor Stores....
The are Privately run and only dispense to qualified Patients... They are not Opened to the General Public.. Huge Difference....

So you clearly neglected to read the second paragraph of my post. Then you jumped to asking me a leading question, which is obviously nothing more than a thinly veiled accusation.

Boy do I hate friggin repeating myself, especially within a single thread. I never said whether I agree or disagree with this rationale. I threw out a legal parallel to help folks without much exposure to or knowledge of U.S. jurisprudence understand this ruling. DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER!!!!!!!!!!

[ZENITH]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

A California Court of Appeals decision for the first time gives cities and counties the choice to allow or disallow medical marijuana dispensaries.

In a Tuesday decision, the California Court of Appeal published an opinion upholding a lower court's injunction stopping a medical marijuana dispensary from operating in Los Angeles County.

In this case, the city of Claremont issued a moratorium preventing the issuance of a business license or other approvals for medical marijuana dispensaries as uses not permitted under the city's zoning ordinance.

Earlier this week in Lake Forest messengers began delivering 35 civil complaints against property owners and tenants connected to 14 medical marijuana dispensaries in the city. The city hopes to shut down the shops. The city's municipal code prohibits uses not explicitly allowed in commercial areas and prohibits businesses that violate state and federal law, said City Attorney Scott Smith.

"The decision is important to Lake Forest because the decision says not only that cities can decide whether or not to allow dispensaries but that state law – Compassionate Use Act – does not require cities to allow marijuana dispensaries," said Jeffrey Dunn, an attorney with Best, Best and Krieger who is handling the cases for Lake Forest.

Pot dispensary advocates argued almost two weeks ago at the Lake Forest City Council that that cities did not have the right to regulate or ban dispensaries because the Compassionate Use Act allows persons to use marijuana for certain medicinal uses.

But Dunn said that the Compassionate Use Act has the purpose to exempt certain people with specific medical conditions from violating state criminal law. He added that federal law still forbids marijuana use.

In light of the recent court ruling Dunn said the case could be precedent-setting and could and for the first time provide clarity and guidance to California counties and cities facing decisions regarding the regulation of marijuana dispensaries.

"From a legal perspective, it's a big deal," he said. "Now a city and county can decide to have or not have a dispensary. It clarified what a city can do."

About 150 pro-pot proponents vowed to return for the October City Council meeting to work toward keeping city dispensaries going by collaborating with city officials on how to regulate them.

"The solution is to regulate them," said Ryan Michaels, 27, who works with several of the Lake Forest dispensaries, to assure they are in compliance. "I don't think the problem is the city of Lake Forest. They are being pushed by their attorneys. The solution is regulating them and mitigating them through patient fundraisers. Potentially, we can come to a compromise."

Dunn said that there are cities in the state that have allowed dispensaries and attempted to regulate them.

"It's a struggle," he said. "How do you keep illegal activities out of them? That's really tough to do."
http://www.420magazine.com/forums/in...ce-cities.html

What is the bottom line??

huh??

are all the city's in cali gonna use this PUBLISHED opinion to close every last store front??

or do we get to drive 700 miles north to oakland?

this is the opinion they were stalling for...watch how fast this crap goes down now...starting tuesday...watch

[X Runner]

Let's be there to complain. In numbers and loudly. Just posting doesn't do too much good. We're preaching to the choir. Tuesday's PLUM meeting is one of the last chances to influence the city before we see the final ordnance. Once the final one comes out, there won't be much wiggle room unless operators and patients complain now. With emails, with letters, with personal interviews, with your presence at key city meetings. It's either that or live with whatever comes down without a fight.

[cephas]

Maybe, though hopefully some lawmakers will see the benefit in Co-ops. They allow pawn shops, check cashing stores and nasty liquor stores. Not saying Co-ops are like any of those (though some are as bad or worse, many are better), just saying those stores get allowed so somebody will allow MMJ....

[X Runner]

No maybes about it. The issue isn't whether a co-op or a collective will be allowed. They will be without a doubt. What is the issue is whether/how many storefront dispensaries will be permitted in LA. I haven't heard any definite numbers but there are going to be hundreds of disappointed dispensary operators and thousands of disappointed patients. Even more difficult is the tiny number of members it takes to trigger all those reporting, permitting, and security requirements. The initial costs will be high and so will the ongoing costs over and above the normal costs of a grow. If there are three or more people in your collective/co-op, you could possibly be compelled to comply on the spot or risk closure. Don't like this? Tuesday, Sept. 29, City Hall.

[ZENITH]

The published opinion is here....city's will decide store fronts.

this what they hoped for...thats why post ico's were turned down...

180 pre ico's...will be scrutinized....what will happen??

ya showing at tues meeting is somthing ...but they have the power.


law suits are filed...this years harvest will be a great one....but what about next years....

with little or no coops to provide access...full legalization is the only hope for patients.

[Smilodon]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

I would agree with you if all of us Patients are out to score and get High...
Are you one of those who believes this???
Dispensaries are not like Liquor Stores....
The are Privately run and only dispense to qualified Patients... They are not Opened to the General Public.. Huge Difference....

You really don't have to get so excited you attack one of our most solid posters. Everyone knows where VDC is coming from, always solid info and good rational arguments.

I keep saying the future is bright and this decision does not change that:

AG Guidlines clearly state coops/collectives are legal.

Obama calls off the DEA (I mean you do remember last year and the year before, hehe).

4th circuit says collective dispensaries are legal.

3rd circuit says cash only commitment to collectives is legal.

The Strauss-Maligno case says juries will no longer regard a large amount of marijuana as automatic evidence of guilt, they will take into account the number of people it has been grown for.

Yes they are treating MMJ like alcohol, that was the analogy. VDC did not come up with that idea, she was pointing out that is how they ended another prohibition.

The decision that Counties and Cities can make these decisions is actually progress. It says that they CAN support dispensaries if they decide to. Now it is our job to make sure that is their decision.

[zaa]

lets hypothetically say that they (whatever county you are in) imposes a moratorium or outright ban on "dispensaries".

obviously they can do this because cities across CA are hopping on the bandwagon like its goin outa style.

however does this remove the functions and guidelines expressly allowed by Prop 215 SB 420 and A.G. guidelines?

if I were a patient that self supplied, would these laws/regulations/moratoriums affect my own personal garden? no.

So if I collectively garden with one other person (within limits) on my own private land, am I subject to the rules/regulations/zoning applications that dispensaries are? (obviously I would have to remain 215 compliant, I'm talking about regulations that are aimed solely at storefront dispensaries)

I shouldn't be.

so then what changes if I were to open a storefront so as to better serve the members/patients in a more reliable fashion?

or what if it was to reduce my risk of robbery? You cant be (rather,.. 'shouldnt be') having people coming and going from a grow location all day long.


a "dispensary" per say is illegal by definition, a "dispensing collective" on the other hand should be subject to the exact same conditions of a small (non store front) collective.

at what point is a "small personal collective grow" subject to the COUNTY laws regarding "dispensaries"?

[DreamSmoker]

Originally Posted by VooDoo Chile

So you clearly neglected to read the second paragraph of my post. Then you jumped to asking me a leading question, which is obviously nothing more than a thinly veiled accusation.

Boy do I hate friggin repeating myself, especially within a single thread. I never said whether I agree or disagree with this rationale. I threw out a legal parallel to help folks without much exposure to or knowledge of U.S. jurisprudence understand this ruling. DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER!!!!!!!!!!

I want to be clear on this...
I am sorry if I appear to attack you.... I just did not see it the way you do..
I realize we are here to voice opinions.. Some with more Passion than others..
I will try to be more assertive and not so aggressive.. We are family here and sometimes as in a family... Members don't always see things the same way...
I hope other do the same....

[ladyknight]

If this is true and the cities get to decide if collectives are allowed, then it is time for me to move. Money talks as always. My taxes will go to a city that allows it.

I may be only 1 person but my dollars count when they support the county.

[DreamSmoker]

Originally Posted by ladyknight

If this is true and the cities get to decide if collectives are allowed, then it is time for me to move. Money talks as always. My taxes will go to a city that allows it.

I may be only 1 person but my dollars count when they support the county.

I am upset too..
Since I became a MMJ Patient.. I feel like I am no longer an American who has rights......
I have had my local city come to my house and Take my Garden and tell me they will prosecute me for growing my own plants... And Now they will be able to decide if I will even have any access at all......

[plisskin]

Lady knight u r very smart. The only thing that this country respects anymore is money. Take it elsewhere and use your power.

One question - for all the people who constantly complain there aren't enough people at these things - no one bothers to show up etc(first off i am very busy...smoking) what about the dispenseries? From what I understand they have amassed a lot of economic power - can't they show up? Can't they afford the best lawyers in the world? Can't they form a lobby organization and start throwing fundraisers and re-election parties to start influencing government officials the way other large organizations do? Government only respects people that can bribe them.

And if they can't do that then the more revolutionary method would be to put together an mmj army. If blackwater can exist for Christian maniacs why can't we have a weed mercenary army? The club owners have the money to make anything happen.

[X Runner]

I'm one of those who is always complaining about the lack of numbers at council meetings. How else can we influence these people? They pass regulations without having the public vote on them so our only chance is to get in their faces at these public meetings. If nobody had been going these last few years, I guarantee you that medical marijuana would have been run out of town long ago. How can patients and dispensary operators be so passive when they are about to be railroaded?

[Smilodon]

Originally Posted by ladyknight

If this is true and the cities get to decide if collectives are allowed, then it is time for me to move. Money talks as always. My taxes will go to a city that allows it.

I may be only 1 person but my dollars count when they support the county.

The truth is easy to see when spoken simply and eloquently, thank you LK.

[Smilodon]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

I want to be clear on this...
I am sorry if I appear to attack you.... I just did not see it the way you do..
I realize we are here to voice opinions.. Some with more Passion than others..
I will try to be more assertive and not so aggressive.. We are family here and sometimes as in a family... Members don't always see things the same way...
I hope other do the same....

I, for one, appreciate a tracker that posts this way. It is true, we all get ..umm... carried away with rhetoric sometimes (except me of course, lmao). I would like to add my apologies to those comments found divisive. We are all one community moving toward one goal. After that, I think the agenda is full as well, but first things first, step by step:


AG Guidlines clearly state coops/collectives are legal.

Obama calls off the DEA.

4th circuit says collective dispensaries are legal.

3rd circuit says cash only commitment to collectives is legal.

The Strauss-Maligno case says juries will no longer regard a large amount of marijuana as automatic evidence of guilt, they will take into account the number of people it has been grown for.

yes, I know I posted most of this already, it just amazes me how far we have come in 2 short years.

[VooDoo Chile]

Originally Posted by DreamSmoker

I want to be clear on this...
I am sorry if I appear to attack you.... I just did not see it the way you do..
I realize we are here to voice opinions.. Some with more Passion than others..
I will try to be more assertive and not so aggressive.. We are family here and sometimes as in a family... Members don't always see things the same way...
I hope other do the same....

Hey, no problemo dude. I understand and respect your passion.

But I still think there's some miscommunication going on here. I wasn't voicing an opinion. An opinion would be "Gee what an awesome ruling!" or "Christ, what a shitty decision!" I didn't say anything to either of those effects. I made a legal parallel, nothing more, nothing less. I've yet to give my opinion on this matter.